HOLY SHIT DID EVERYONE SEE?

[Admiral Striker General]

www.pokemon.com/

DISCUSS.

[Baroness Charmissey]

OMG!! That... That is EPIC!! I have been waiting for a pokemon game like that! Thanks for shareing that SG!! I love you!! <3

[Maid Melody]

That's so cool xxD didn't they like just come out with Black and White 2 though? (which I still haven't beaten Black or Black 2 yet >>;; Though I love the fire fox so much <3 almost makes me sad I don't have a 3DS *sigh*

[Ball Rat]

I will be saving up for a 3DS ASAP. Which should be interesting, as I have no job. >.< Anyway, that fox thing is the cutest thing ever. I usually avoid the cute one because I know so many people will get it and I hate jumping on the bandwagon but... can't resist the fennec<3

[MCstorms]

Got to be honest only looking forward to the game play as of now, hopefully that will change.

[Admiral Striker General]

x'3; I'm legitimately disappointed guys, I FUCKING DESPISE that generic-ass obnoxious fennec. (I DO have some hope for its evos though. BUT I FUCKING SWEAR IF IT'S FIRE/FIGHTING. x'3 (Though that kind oflooked like Psywave or something it was using?? ...In which case I'ma scream Victini but yeh.))

Literally the only thing I can appreciate about it, other than being a fennec and I mean I love fennecs in general, is that it EVEN FURTHER invalidates the I'd-be-willing-to-bet-literally-thousands-or-at-least-hundreds of Fakemon cat/dog/fox starters, especially fire-types (which are the most prevalent among fakes too). I've spent too many years bitching at all of them to NOT be pissed when Nintendo does it themselves. xD Fox is still SLIGHTLY better than a cat or dog but man.

CAN I SAY HOW MUCH I LOVE CHESPIN THOUGH?? IT ONLY TOOK SIX GENERATIONS TO GET A NON-REPTILE(/arguably amphibian for all of one) GRASS STARTER.

[SongofWindchimes]

Well, I guess I'm going to be buying a 3DS come October.

I am incapable of not liking Fennekin, generic fox fire type or no. It's a fennec. If its evolutions turn out well (I'm hoping for fire running along the shoulders and back for the final evolution) I will die of squee.

That said, Chespin presses my 'want plushie of now' button. Very much. And Froakie's so cute, too (Bianca's going want for some reason and she doesn't even normally like frogs).

[MCstorms]

Well Fennekin doesn't piss me off becuase well they have done that shit before. Case and point Gen 4 starters and hell even gen 5 starters. And again all I see is copy/paste of oshawatt with a few minor changes. Also what do you mean might be amphibian turtles are amphibious.

[Ball Rat]

Jan 9, 2013 19:51:31 GMT -5 MCstorms said:

Also what do you mean might be amphibian turtles are amphibious.

Tortoises, however, are not, which is what Squirtle actually seems to be based on.


On the fact of Fennekin: yes, I only like it so much because it's a fennec. If it were a generic red fox, I wouldn't be so impressed but real life fennecs are THE most adorable things EVAR!

[Admiral Striker General]

I love Fennecs but that doesn't change how terrible Fennekin is. x'3; Aywas has also ruined me a bit because I am so tired of seeing big-eared fluffy cat/dog/fox/generic creatures.

(Like really guys do you know how long Espeon was my favorite Eon just because it was the closes thing to a fennec? x'3; I mean Umbreon stole its thunder because my crush/boyfriend's avatar/username (for several years in the Gen2-Gen3 era anyway) was Shiny Umbreon but aside from specifically reminding me of him Espeon was still there being awesome and secretly preferred in many cases. Annnd then I got a bit annoyed of it when it became near Mew status in overdone over-played-up-ness (no guys great as they are no Eeveelutions are Legendary in any region, unless you're counting the Legendary Beasts as Eons due to the probability of their preincarnations being some) and fell more in love with Eevee on its own and HOLYSHITGUYSLEAFEON grew on me after it came out and yeah but still. Also I did a huge visual report on fennecs in sixth grade it was great and I went to an animal reserve place that had one once but she was snappy and moody and couldn't be pet even though she was close enough to be and I WAS SO SAD because man fennecs are SO GREAT on their own but that doesn't mean I have to like everything based on one.

X3;;; When I think about it I WOULD PROBABLY BE ONLY MILDLY ANNOYED at "wow there are like a thousand fakes that look just like this" and be able to get over it for my utter fennec love IF FENNEKIN WASN'T A STARTER or even a TEENSY chance if it wasn't a FIRE starter just ALL THOSE THINGS ADDING UP I CAN'T I'M SORRY.)

And MC, turtles are "amphibious" in that they live part of their lives in water, but biologically they're reptiles. (Tere is right in that tortoises are not amphibious in any sense, though Turtwig rather than Squirtle is what would be applicable to what I was saying since I was discussing only Grass starters.)

The arguable grass starter is Bulbasaur, which is "saur" like dinosaur and has claws and shit but is also rather similar in structure to a frog, and its Japanese name more reflects that iirc. The others are a blatant dinosaur (which may not technically be a reptile but is still reptilian and generally regarded as "giant lizards" even if they're more related to birds), a gecko (reptile), tortoise (reptile), and snake (reptile). Now we finally get a mammal<3 (A bird would have been great but yeah.)

For Fire, we have a lizard/dragon (reptile) with slight salamander-ness (technically amphibian but lizard-shaped and Charmander veers more reptilian as it evolves), a mole/badger (mammal), a chicken/birdman (bird), a monkey (mammal), and a pig (mammal). If anything it's pretty mammal-heavy with two thirds of starters now being them. Still, it's not as bad as Grass.

And then Water, where we have a turtle/tortoise (reptile), crocodile (reptile), axolotl (amphibian), penguin (bird), and an otter/sea lion (mammal), and now a frog (amphibian). Like man. Water is great it has the most variety and the biggest balance.


But no MC. You are literally digging for similarities; I gave you a massive list of differences between Chespin and Oshawott and you've yet to provide any more similarities than what I listed myself. Speaking of, that was all of three, and I'd like to remove one upon seeing a larger/clearer image, because Chespin's nose is considerably less obtrusive and a triangle where Oshawott's is much larger and an oval.

You tell me what you see that's similar that can't be justified by "Pokemon has a recognizable style like any good series" (which includes things like "the ways they draw eyes" and "vague body proportions" that make things "look like a Pokemon" more than looking "like" any specific other Pokemon, because God DAMN if they DO veer too far from the style you all bitch that "it looks like a Digimon/Yu-Gi-Oh/Power Rangers/wtfever". x3;; Damned if they do and damned if they don't much?) and I'll consider the vague possibility your point is worth listening to. Because I see NOT ONE SINGLE TRAIT.

x'3; Also show me what is as bad as Fennekin because I can probably dig up at least a dozen Fakemon that look almost just like it without even including people's fake Eeveelutions. (And if I go for those hot damn we'll be swimming in several hundred nearly identical recolors, most but probably not all of which will have slight additions like bug wings or cloud wisps but not much else.) I am FAIRLY sure I would have thrown a hissy fit already if they'd already done something like it but like I said Aywas has helped ruin me so maybe I really just didn't notice and it's slipping my mind now.

[Jay]

orz... is it sad I want the Fennec to evolve into a Fossa? I get anatomically they're dissimilar but we've seen various evolutions that don't follow exact trains.

[MCstorms]

show me what is as bad as Fennekin

You already answered that as far as originality goes. Gen 4 starters all looked like their Pokemon Penguin,monkey and turtle to the point where it was hard to see them as Pokemon and not animals.

Gen 5 with the exception of the Clown otter fusion of oshawatt , Tepig was a recolored pig and Snivy had a Few leaves on it, and arms/legs. So Fennekin doesn't piss me off becuase it's been done before.

Also I never said my Chespin/oshawatt thing was concrete. That's just what I see when I look at Chespin. It's like two different people having two different interpretations of a painting.



Also Turtwig ca learn a water move as far as I'm concerned it's an amphibian.

[Admiral Striker General]

@jay: Man Fossa would be awesome. xD Like idc if from Fennekin or on its own they're just pretty cool.

---

@mc: x'3;Except your interpretation of this painting is blatantly wrong. That's like both of us looking at a triangle and you saying "that looks like a square", and me saying "no it's a triangle" and you saying "I don't care to me it looks like a square". You can think it all you want but it doesn't make it one ounce of valid to the rest of the world until you can find any basis at all I'm sorry. x3;;

And

heaven

forbid

any

Pokemon

ever

look

too

much

like

a

regular

old

animal

or

an

animal

with

just

some

cartoony

colors

and/or

markings

and/or

minor

decor

like

leaves

or

flames

tacked

on

like

I

couldn't

even

imagine

a

Pokemon

world

where

that

was

a

common

thing

across

all

generations.

[Jay]

Ever since I saw it and my brain went "KITTYCAT" I've wanted one :I. I like... I don't even understand why but then I remembered Fennics are mostly African and was like 8U makeitintoagiantcatthingthat'snotacat...

[Admiral Striker General]

x'3 Good job Jay.

:UUU Also looks like Xerneas looks a lot less like Dialga/etc (and a lot cooler!) than the trailer made it look like! I am happy about this!

(ALSO I WOULD BE VERY FUCKING OKAY WITH THIS. *DROOLS*)

[MCstorms]

SG most of the Pokemon you listed look somewhat original to the point where it could be hard to tell what they were. Lets take mareep for instance has yellow wool a striped long tail with a bulb at the end of it. with two weird horn things on the side of it's head , and is blue. Chimchar is a red monkey with fire for a tail

Lets use another example. Ekans a rattle snake that is purple and yellow. Probably the most basic one on there if you ask me. Then compare it to turtwig who has a twig on it's head. And Yes cartoony colors make all the difference that's what makes Pokemon Pokemon. Hell isn't that the entire reason you hate Fennekin?

[Maid Melody]

Mareep is based on a sheep MC ^_^;; this argument is ridiculous. Ya know, rams have horns right....a Mareep could very well be a ram. Aaaand you're only proving SG's point with the Chimchar bit. Every one of the pokemon SG showed can easily be said that they were based on a real life animal and I can tell you what they are later but just don't have time to right now because I need to head to work. Turtwig = turtle with a twig on his head.....seriously animals with decorations or add ons ^_^;; just like SG said. >>;; I think you missed what SG was trying to say in the first place. non-cartoony colors is not why she doesn't like Fennekin....it's because (if I read correctly) fox/dog/wolf pokes are generic and have been over done (I love Fennekin personally because I have a stuffy of a fennec fox and would definitely name it after said stuffy if I can get the game but I just love fennecs in general so hush). Perhaps you should read carefully to make sure ya know what the other person is saying MC ^_^

[Admiral Striker General]

Ursaring is a bear with a ring on its belly. You can argue its shoulder fur is a little but noteworthy but that's a weak argument at best.

Mareep has cartoony colors and a big weird tail, and stripes on its cartoony EARS. Yellow-ish wool isn't even that rare IRL though.

Turtwig has a shell with big patches of dirt in it, and it has a HUGE cartoony jaw. Squirtle has a swirly tail and stands upright and is blue, but with a more generic face and a plain shell. It might have one point over Turtwig. One and a half tops. Chimchar has a unique cartoony swirl of hair on its head and unrealistic eye markings-- which gives it two more unique traits than CHARMANDER which is literally a bipedal lizard with fire on its tail. And lizards can be that color so that doesn't work for your argument.

If we go evos, Blastoise is a bigger turtle with cannons. The cannons are kind of cool, but "adding a weapon to a real creature" isn't big on originality points by your logic. Torterra is a FUCKING ISLAND TURTLE with spikes and awesomeness. Blastoise's face looks like Bowser while Torterra's looks like a badass. Charizard is THE MOST GENERIC DRAGON IN POKEMON WITH FIRE ON ITS TAIL. The shape of its horns is the most original thing going for it, and the mildly annoying colors/marking are the literally only other thing. Meanwhile, Infernape is an interesting interpretation of the legend of the Monkey King with unique but tribute-paying markings/decor while still incorporating its fiery element.

And no, MC, you have missed my point by ten thousand percent.

It's not that it's a generic animal.

It's that it's THE MOST generic animal drawn in the MOST generic way THAT EVERY FAN EVER has also drawn.

Watch just this one video that I didn't make and look at all the cats/dogs/foxes you see (and four-legged pawed mammals in general, including quite a few bear cubs that come out kind of similarly, but we don't even NEED to count them). The one at 1:19 is especially great for my point. If I had the time and drive I could find SO many more you wouldn't even believe it, but the fact that a single random video that was the first thing to come up when I searched "fake pokemon starters" is already so supportive should say a lot.
(Ignore that a few of the "fakes" are stylized actual Pokemon this maker seems kind of dumb. x3; )

www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQx8I6lehNg


(Edit: I lied, I dared to hit the browse button on dA.

Set of Fire Starters
sakuyamon.deviantart.com/art/No-4-Corocat-59054802?q=gallery%3Asakuyamon%2F3297561&qo=73
sakuyamon.deviantart.com/art/No-5-Pyreon-59054873?q=gallery%3Asakuyamon%2F3297561&qo=74
sakuyamon.deviantart.com/art/No-6-Solareon-59055063?q=gallery%3Asakuyamon%2F3297561&qo=75 (I saw a different version of the final on YouTube that was still quadrupedal idk)

Two trios of Fire-types by another artist
darksilvania.deviantart.com/art/Firebolt-V-2-0-206582209?q=gallery%3Adarksilvania%2F742300&qo=42
darksilvania.deviantart.com/art/Spirit-Fox-V-2-0-181784758?q=gallery%3Adarksilvania%2F742300&qo=65

Someone else's starters:
fc02.deviantart.net/fs17/f/2007/173/6/7/Fake_Pokemon_by_Jen_Jen_Rose.png

Someone else's:
browse.deviantart.com/?qh=§ion=&global=1&q=fake+fire+starter+pokemon&offset=20#/d1fo4tt

Someone else's:
fc09.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2012/172/d/f/fire_starter_by_ewout12-d54asnl.gif

Someone else's:
fc08.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2012/150/2/e/starter_evelutions_2_by_michelle4645-d51og3p.png

About the only way I would have been madder at Fennekin, someone else's fire starter:
fc03.deviantart.net/fs39/f/2009/001/5/9/FIRE_STARTER______4__by_mssingno.png

Someone else's:
fc01.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2012/176/b/6/embrit_by_deidara_fuuka-d2mp0rv.png

Someone else's:
f-r-e-q-u-e.deviantart.com/gallery/?catpath=scraps&offset=24#/d1ejq88

,,,,,,,,,,,,, xD;;;; PROBABLY THE WORSE SET I'VE SEEN LIKE WOW.
fc04.deviantart.net/fs39/i/2008/345/d/5/Fake_Pokemon_Starters_by_TheDragonGirl88.jpg
According to the artist, it's a fire fox, water husky, and grass hyena. And I'm dying laughing I love the hyena on its own actually but oh God.

More starters:
fc04.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2011/324/c/8/falloh_region_starters_by_dragara-d4gtnht.jpg

Two sets, see left (not that right is tons better):
fc05.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2011/095/f/b/epic_starters_vs_sub_starters_by_lourdeath-d3d9u4w.jpg

More:
fc00.deviantart.net/fs39/f/2008/337/5/9/fakemon___Fire_Starters_by_sinnohandbeyond.jpg

More:
fc05.deviantart.net/fs31/i/2008/216/8/2/fire_starters_by_superlauren.jpg

More:
th02.deviantart.net/fs70/PRE/i/2012/097/4/6/fakemon___fire_starter_by_sfthunder615-d4valqf.png

Yup:
fc03.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/150/1/0/Fake_Fire_Starter_Pokemon_by_xXCystalTheWolfXx.png

Yyyup:
fc04.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2011/028/d/5/fake_starters__fire_by_dragonsoul2-d387vdv.jpg

More:
fc02.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2011/229/0/9/fake_starters_2_by_joshd1000-d46v4ph.jpg

It:
th06.deviantart.net/fs70/PRE/f/2010/049/6/9/691e9cc7eb698e32f6d57ca838ab1feb.png

Never:
fc03.deviantart.net/fs32/i/2008/228/8/6/Fake_PKMN_Fire_starters_by_PachirisuLuva.jpg

Ends:
fc09.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2011/303/e/7/e77962589ecce1abfcf0ff0483000a4b-d4egg9d.png

Ever:
th07.deviantart.net/fs71/PRE/f/2012/086/7/f/fire_starter_through_the_years_by_requiem_raptor-d4u573d.png

More:
fc01.deviantart.net/fs32/f/2008/226/3/2/32d86fd3561421f1b39f5d25f374fe6f.jpg

More:
fc05.deviantart.net/fs50/i/2009/302/a/4/Starter_Fire_Pokemon___Draft_by_YamiBroly777.jpg

Sigh:
fc09.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2012/334/d/6/d6756f0d23b242e5d2120808f971481a-d3is1p6.png

Sigh:
fc00.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2013/009/f/5/fiery_mastiff___at_last_the_fire_starter_by_soul5-d5qhpp7.png

Sigh:
fc08.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2011/084/4/e/griger__fire_starter__by_gorlava-d3cgyqs.jpg

Yup:
fc05.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2012/054/9/a/004_tiglaze_by_dragonith-d3hb68s.png

At least the art is nice:
fc06.deviantart.net/fs40/f/2009/017/9/9/Hineko_portrait_by_Eclipsis.jpg

List goes on:
fc06.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2012/098/b/2/commission__8_by_scarex3wer-d4vgj75.png

And on:
th07.deviantart.net/fs71/PRE/f/2011/018/d/7/fake_starters_by_bummerdude-d37i1ts.png

Sigh:
fc04.deviantart.net/fs43/f/2009/137/0/c/Collab_FKMN_Smokat_by_Platina_Jolteon.png

Best fire wolf period. XD
fc08.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2011/270/b/f/who_zat_pokeymon_by_f3nx-d4b0i7t.png

xD And I think I'll end on that because holy shit that last one is legitimately great. Didn't include a ton that were still pretty similar to Fennekin because 'well I guess it's more a rat/rabbit/otter/bear/etc' so I gave them a 'pass'. Also ignored most/all grass/water foxes/etc. There are a lot more but really I'm tired of looking..)

[Admiral Striker General]

Right also a long-ass time ago my own shitty Fire starter was a wolf pup. x'3 I later scrapped it for being utter shit. And yelled at my best fakemon-making partner for wanting to make a fire lion because fuck no everyone did that and no.

[SongofWindchimes]

Jan 10, 2013 22:14:00 GMT -5 MCstorms said:

Also Turtwig ca learn a water move as far as I'm concerned it's an amphibian.

*twitch*

The only 'water' move Turtwig is capable of learning via level up, egg moves, Move Tutor, or TMs in either the fourth or fifth generation is Withdraw. Withdraw just involves the pokemon in question hiding in its shell to increase its defenses and has nothing to do with water at all. The only reason it is classified as water type is because, in the first generation, the only pokemon who could learn it were the Squirtle line, the Shellder line, the Omanyte line, and Slowbro.

By this logic, Nidoking must be an insect, because it can learn Megahorn, which is classified as bug type for much the same reason; when the move was introduced in the second generation, only Heracross could learn it. Not to mention Torkoal can learn Withdraw as well, and I doubt a fire type that explicitly burns coal inside of its shell is going to hop into a body of water on a whim.

Furthermore, even if the species were partially aquatic, that doesn't make it an amphibian, which are animals of the class Amphibia, which consists of frogs, salamanders and caecilians. Turtles and tortoises are both part of the order Testudines of the class Reptilia. Even if the Turtwig family were based on turtles instead of tortoises, they would still be reptiles.

OKAY GETTING BACK TO THE GEN SIX POKEMON.

I guess the reason Fennekin doesn't bother me is because I tend to look at fantasy critters, particularly pokemon, from a sort of...partial in-universe perspective? In the sense that, if I were a new trainer waiting to get my starter and that popped out the pokeball and looked up at me with its big, red eyes, I would wanna cuddle it because big fuzzy fennec ears.

Basically, I agree with the criticism, myself, but it just doesn't make me hate the little thing for it. *shrug* I do have to admit, though, if I were going to design a pokemon after a fennec, it'd be a non-evolving ground type that maybe learned one or two fire attacks via TM like zoroark, rather than a fire-type starter.

Jan 11, 2013 3:10:40 GMT -5 Admiral Striker General said:

(ALSO I WOULD BE VERY FUCKING OKAY WITH THIS. *DROOLS*)

Oh, wow. Yes, that would be incredibly awesome.

Even if the evolution doesn't look like that, I could see hybridizing with Sandslash or Excadrill here on VC to get something close. Wow.

Also, Xerneas = <3 . I have always gotten the second game in every pair (Silver, Sapphire, Pearl, White...), but I'm considering buying X instead of Y and breaking that streak.